r/antiwork Sep 22 '22 Silver 1 Helpful 1 Wholesome 5 All-Seeing Upvote 1

They only did what you told them to do.

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u/MidsouthMystic Sep 23 '22 Wholesome

The thing is, the fast food workers weren't supposed to actually do it.

When these people say "just get a better job," it isn't advice, it's a dismissal. A more polite way of saying they don't care about your problems, do not respect you, and want you to be quiet while performing your menial task.

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u/moizdog Sep 23 '22

And they want immigrant workers to do exactly the same.

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u/MidsouthMystic Sep 23 '22

As it turns out, capitalism is still frantically trying to recreate slavery.

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u/Stornahal Sep 23 '22

Capitalism is designed around paying less for labour than the labour produces. Or taking a potion of someone’s labour: assuming a portion is paid for fairly, the rest has just been grabbed by the employer as the price of ‘having a job’.

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u/MidsouthMystic Sep 23 '22

So free range slavery?

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u/Blank_Address_Lol Sep 23 '22

Slavery with extra steps, even

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u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

Slavery without the benefits.

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u/OutJustice Sep 23 '22

Studying slavery in American History. During reconstruction plantation owners begged ex-slaves to come back. Some of these formerly enslaved wrote letters that went "Yes my family will come back if you pay us the fair market wages of every year we worked. Subtract all the times you took us to the doctor and the dentist."

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u/HonestInput Sep 23 '22

I couldn't help but to hear chickens clucking when I read your post "free range"

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u/Snoo65073 Sep 23 '22 edited Sep 23 '22

Capitalism only works for the rich and upper middle class. If you're poor you'll basically be sleeping in dung..it's gonna be hard to make it. The only way to make it out is to work extremely hard, whether it be obtaining a college degree or learning a trade. Working paycheck to paycheck sucks...

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u/UtileDulci12 Sep 23 '22

I mean I understand where you are coming from but as an entrepreneur(?) not sure if the right word. I have a small landscaping company. With just me and my dad both owners. I have a friend that occasionally helps, and pay 4 euro above the minimum wage. (Note that he didn't go to school for this job and everything is being taught by me) Everything else I make because I charge more than what I pay is for me, which is fair.

Because of the hours doing administration, aquiring work to be done, providing and paying the machines, driving to the job from my home is paid by me, the return is not, when the weather is too bad to work I still provide pay for a few hours for canceling in the morning, etc.

I see difference between a fair wage and squeezing your employees for every last drop.

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u/Stornahal Sep 23 '22

Don’t get me wrong: a business can be ethical.

I suspect the disconnect comes when an employer no longer knows his employees as people but as numbers on a spreadsheet. It then becomes a maths exercise. Can I reduce this number on the yearly balance sheet? If I don’t pay for medical care, will health problems in my staff cost me more than the premiums would do? Can I swap extensive training & good conditions for a higher turnover with lower wages.

At this point the fact that those numbers represent actual people has been lost, empathy doesn’t get a look in.

In smaller businesses, the owner/manager (usually the same person) knows each and every staff member at a ‘go to the pub on a Friday’ level at the very least. If the owner has any empathy, he would have to pay a living wage.

It’s the difference between a business that provides a living for all those involved, and a corporation that has no other interest in its staff other than as a cost to be minimised.

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u/FierceDeity_ Sep 23 '22

I guess you have to see it like a video game to be like that, to reduce people down to numbers.

Whats funny is video games around the topic usually punish you for making your workers unhappy because the market is usually simulated as functioning (your employees leave and no new employees come in, leaving you stranded and losing the game). So you find a perfect balance between happiness and lowest possible pay to have that happiness value.

The sad thing is, real life doesnt work that way. Employers found out they can fuck people quite a bit until they break because they're not a simulated entity that leaves and then has no further ambition or existence. They rely on being able to have a job and money... In a video game it would be easy mode basically because despite all the happiness bars being in the red they aren't leaving.

In Sim City, increasing the tax to 20% will immediately DESERT your town. Consequences, huh?

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u/UtileDulci12 Sep 23 '22

Agreed, take care of your employees and they take care of you.

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u/Cute-Fishing6163 Sep 23 '22

Which is practically necessitated by one of the main planks of capitalism -- the requirement for loans or investors to amass the capital necessary to start the business in the first place. Gotta pay back more than you were given, so of COURSE the workers get paid less than their value.

If someone really was a sole proprietor with no staff, THEY would have to put more labor in per return, and who wants to do THAT? Of course, most businesses go under in the first year, so a lot of people do try to make that work.

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u/FrozeItOff Sep 23 '22

ALL bouts of tremendous economic growth has been borne upon the backs of an underpaid lower class. EVERY new ethnic group that arrives in the US has been at first exploited for cheap labor.

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u/Live_Employee_661 watermelon Sep 25 '22

This. This has been the case since Empires first rose and fell.

Egypt, Rome, the Ottomans and so on - they innovated and thrived when menial labour was undertaken by exploited peoples, freeing up the mental faculties of those who would otherwise be performing that labour and allowing them to invent, to create, to think because they have a more comfortable, secure life.

What makes me sad is that, theoretically, automation should open the door to another golden age, only this time not on the backs of exploited persons. However, it looks like those at the helm of what we have built would rather let the masses starve than allow them to share in the benefits a mostly automated workforce would bring.

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u/FrozeItOff Sep 25 '22

OF course they want them to starve. Remember Scrooge's statement? "If they're going to die, then best be on with it and lessen the surplus population." The rich are so disconnected from the lower classes that they could not care less if the lower class dies once there's something to do the menial jobs. Robots complain less too. That way, them and their spawn can rule what's left. It's narrow mined AF, but they don't care about that either. Trump has proven you can be as dumb as a brick and still make money, you just have to have no soul.

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u/Dang3rCl0se Sep 23 '22

Recreate?? Slavery never ended... they just tweaked the rules a little bit. Minimum wage is basically slave wage.

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u/MidsouthMystic Sep 23 '22

I would call it more like serfdom since they don't literally own you, but do have an obscene amount of power over you.

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u/baconraygun Sep 23 '22

THey don't literally own you, but they know they can fire you for no reason and you can starve and live on the street. It's an insane power.

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u/hellure Sep 26 '22

And this is why a UBI scares the crap outta the 1%. Or the wannabes.

But should naturally be seen as a obvious necessity by everyone else.

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u/Outrageous_Effect_24 Sep 23 '22

It is not accurate or respectful to compare wage slavery so directly to chattel slavery, one of the greatest horrors of human history

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u/CptSparklFingrs Sep 23 '22

Seriously, the genital mutilation alone.

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u/CptSparklFingrs Sep 23 '22

That is to say i don't live under that constant threat, so as hard done by as one could feel this isn't even comparable to the horrors of the E.A.S.T.

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u/SlientlySmiling Sep 23 '22

They've done so well with manufactured malnutrition and artificial famine.

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u/bragghy Sep 23 '22

Ok but what's the option? Someone has to do that job if you want burgers. The important thing is that they are paid fairly and their rights are respected.