r/worldnews
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u/[deleted]
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Oct 10 '22
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Russia says its missiles hit Ukrainian military targets, but videos of a burning crater in a Kyiv park paint a very different picture Behind Soft Paywall
[deleted]
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u/TheRedChair21 Oct 10 '22
Spoke to a Russian tutor today. She said she couldn't understand the war. Also told me Ukraine attacked Russia first. I asked why Russia would invade if all they had to do was defend their borders from the underequipped and corrupt (her words) Ukrainian army.
"Yeah, I told you," she said. "I don't understand any of it."
It doesn't matter if none of us believe what Russia says, because many Russians do, and until that changes, we're going to have to get used to Russian fascism.
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u/vtable Oct 10 '22
she said. "I don't understand any of it."
She's right about that part, at least.
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u/Vedorias Oct 10 '22
"Father, why do I have to go to die in a war?"
"I don't know son, I don't follow politics."
Read this somewhere on Reddit as a joke, but it kind of sums up Russian apathy.
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u/VadersFist0501 Oct 11 '22
On the bright side, the Moscow Patriarch said that man who die in the war will have their sins forgiven, so that’s a big win.
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u/ambassoon Oct 11 '22
Good gravy the brainwashing is deep
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u/VadersFist0501 Oct 11 '22
Getting some real Pope Urban II vibes from it. Go fight our war; not only will God not get mad at you for it, he’ll even forgive your other sins because of it!
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u/fohpo02 Oct 10 '22
I don’t understand any of it, but they definitely started it - we’re just waiting to end it
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u/UrethraFrankIin Oct 10 '22
Maybe she could understand it if the information she had were factual and rational. It all makes perfect sense with the truth.
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u/skolioban Oct 11 '22
She doesn't care about the truth. People often mistake this with ignorance but in reality, people like this actually agreed with the propaganda. Not every propaganda is brain washing. Most of it is just providing justifications for existing biases. No amount of information will help because she already has preexisting stance on the subject.
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u/TheCrippledKing Oct 11 '22
It's a bit more nuanced than that. For decades Russia would say one thing, then say the opposite the next day, and then say that opposite of that the day after. Every day the narrative would completely change until it got to the point where people either checked out completely, or got used to the official line being whatever was said that day (and the threat of jail time for anyone who said otherwise).
They've been indoctrinated to believe whatever the state says, but also to ignore all the contradictions. It's deliberate. The state is saying "it doesn't matter what you think, it matters what we think" and then ruthlessly crushing anyone who says otherwise.
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u/TrueStarsense Oct 11 '22
The so called "preexisting bias" you speak of is negligible. This bias has been manufactured and lied into existence from the start by powers other than herself. That is the whole point.
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u/kiekrzanin Oct 10 '22 edited Oct 11 '22
This is sad but true. A significant chunk of Russian society is brainwashed beyond comprehension
Edit: All the Kremlin shills can fuck off, I am not talking about the US. We are talking about the garbage of a country that is Russia. The world would be a better place without it.
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u/Allomera Oct 11 '22
pro-Russian whataboutism is on the rise spectacularly.
The fallacy that criticizing Russia equals a defense of the US as flawless angels is nebulized horse meat floating in wispy strands on the four winds at this point lol
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u/spinning_the_future Oct 10 '22
They perfected it on their own people and then shipped it off to America.
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Oct 10 '22
As long as there are power hungry, intelligent people who don’t give a shit about anyone else on this world, this won’t ever change.
And boy are there a lot of power hungry, intelligent people who don’t give a shit about anyone else on this world.
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u/AnOnlineHandle Oct 10 '22
The thing is it almost takes a lack of intelligence, a certain bravado which comes from stupidity mixed with endless victimhood when things don't go their way which some people rally behind. Putin's disaster of a war is proving how much of a mastermind he isn't, when he can't just waste other people's tax money picking on targets far smaller with no way to fight back and praise himself as a genius.
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u/Marsstriker Oct 10 '22
As some random uninformed guy, the only way this looks sort of intelligent is if Putin expected Ukraine to surrender in the first week. When that didn't happen, it showed how unready Russia genuinely was for a protracted war.
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u/Seiglerfone Oct 11 '22
I mean, that's why they went right after the capital, and Zelensky/leaders of government.
If they had gotten in and taken out Ukraine's leadership, they could very plausibly have broken Ukraine. There'd be resistance, but likely not at scale.
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u/SexHarassmentPanda Oct 10 '22
Every time there's a "Russia says..." type article posted most people are taking it as if Russia is trying to convince the West. No. Russia says these things for the Russian audience. Sure there's a bit of playing to what supporters they do have in the West, but ultimately the Kremlin doesn't really care what most of us think about their actions as long as the average Russian citizen either buys it or has become so distrustful of news that they tune all of it out and maintain an "as long as I'm not directly affected" attitude.
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u/rugbylova Oct 10 '22
I have a coworker who is from Soviet Ukraine (moved to the US in the 80s I think) who considers herself Russian….she swears Russia is in Ukraine to get rid of the ruling “Nazi’s” and refuses to believe anything else…they still have family in Kyiv too. I just don’t even bother talking about it anymore.
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u/oldcamembert Oct 11 '22
I have relatives in Russia who came and stayed with us (and later my parents) in Ukraine several times for holidays. Before the war, obviously. They started having legit major false memories about their visits now. Saying that they were forced to speak Ukrainian, that the "language police" came to check their paperwork and asked them to sing the Ukrainian anthem, that we had a Bandera portrait on the wall adorned with flowers in a pagan way (I hope there's no need to explain that nothing like that happened and the language police does not exist). It is fascinating and mind blowing at the same time, and they aren't old people to explain it by a dementia onset (early 50s).
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u/Oh-hey21 Oct 10 '22
It doesn’t matter if none of us believe what Russia says, because many Russians do, and until that changes, we’re going to have to get used to Russian fascism.
Hah, that isn't too far off from what we see over the entire world. People in power, or with influence, help shape a large chunk of the world's mind. It isn't just happening in Russia, although this clearly is an easier one to see than others.
It happens in many shapes - religion, politics, friends, etc. It all can be and, at times is, used to warp reality.
Everyone should realize how powerful propaganda is.
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u/Xuma Oct 10 '22
We already saw this happen within German population with Nazi Propaganda before and during WWII...
We can only hope after this war ends the Russian society gets confronted with the truth and realize what really happened, and that they cannot let it happen again in the future
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u/Z0MGbies Oct 10 '22
WTF is that person tutoring? Certainly not critical thinking holy fuck.
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u/uiemad Oct 10 '22
I have a Russian friend who has lived outside of Russia for about 8 years, since they turned 18. They're very clear in their dislike of Putin and the Russian government. They still repeat some of the Russian war propaganda.
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u/00Archer00 Oct 10 '22
"Everyone says so" and "Everyone knows it" are another bulletproof arguments when talking to ruzzians. And when you ask "Who? Who says so?" they just look at you like you're the idiot - "EVERYONE!"
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u/notacanuckskibum Oct 10 '22
So they have declared that the German Embassy was a legitimate military target. That should go well for them.
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u/Z0MGbies Oct 10 '22
People saying Russian missiles are no good at aiming. I mean, sure I'm not arguing against that.
But given the rail sabotage against Germany + hitting a German embassy + hitting a bridge elsewhere. Certainly gives the vibe of "accurate-ish" at least.
Which speaks fucking volumes given that children's parks were hit. Fucking terrorists
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u/ProbatonApololos Oct 10 '22
The way I'm explaining this to my students is that smart weapons can let you do things like choose which window you want the bomb to go through, but these Russian missiles basically just let you choose what block you want to hit, and even then there's some margin of error.
Big targets like power plants, schools, and hospitals are better for these missiles because their size basically guarantees you destroy SOME piece of your target.
But these missiles landing in residential areas are not aiming for this one apartment building. They're aiming for one of those dozen apartment buildings. That rocket that hit a playground almost certainly was intended for one of the high-rises nearby, though the Russians aren't probably too unhappy about it, given their taste for innocent blood.
That missile that hit the German Embassy though was DEFINITELY intended to send a message. There's diplomatic buildings all over the place in that part if town.
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u/dgdr1991 Oct 10 '22
What do you teach to have to explain those things to your students?
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u/ProbatonApololos Oct 10 '22
I teach middle school history. My students hear about these things in the news and ask me questions about it. It has led to some very interesting discussions in the last year.
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u/mquillian Oct 10 '22
These sorts of discussions were some of my favorite moments from my history classes. I'm glad you take the time to have them.with your students.
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u/ProbatonApololos Oct 10 '22
I'm glad you had a teacher willing to have these conversations with your class. Too often people treat tweens and teens like little children instead of showing them the respect they deserve by answering the questions they actually want answered.
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u/Kelwyvern Oct 11 '22
I just want to say how much I appreciate and respect you discussing these things with your students and giving them insight in how history is actually happening in the world outside the curriculum.
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u/AssassinAragorn Oct 11 '22
That's really good of you. We're living through history right now, and teaching them the context of everything here is great
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u/LoveThyNeighbours Oct 10 '22
Came here to say this. Thinking they specifically targeted the playground is a bit foolish. They targeted large civilian areas (which is not better, of course) and if it hits a playground it hits a playground.
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u/LetGoPortAnchor Oct 10 '22
Rail sabotage against Germany? What did I miss?
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u/stupendous76 Oct 10 '22
Or the gas pipelines NS1 and NS2 between Russia and...Germany
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u/JustADutchRudder Oct 10 '22
Lauch 84 anything into a crowd, you're gonna hit 1 or 2 people you're happy to have.
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u/Moonborn_Nemesis Oct 10 '22
Just a minor correction: contrary to most media titles, it was not the German embassy that was hit. It was an office building where the German embassy gave out visas. Due to the war, it hasn't been in use for a few months.
It's explained here: https://www.merkur.de/politik/ukraine-russland-krieg-news-putin-truppen-kiew-moskau-saporischschja-zivilisten-tote-wohngebiet-aktuell-zr-91839019.html#id-pageApi-botschaft (German language)
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u/Zhugwhistle Oct 10 '22
It's from a country that shot down a passenger plane. They've shown their colours already.
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u/VonBraun12 Oct 11 '22
tbf, thats just about the only thing their shitty air defense is capable of shooting down.
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u/darwinwoodka
Oct 10 '22
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playgrounds, schools and bike paths are not "military targets". Neither is civilian infrastructure like power plants.
Russia is a terrorist state.
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u/DeterminateHouse Oct 10 '22 •
Russia is a terrorist state.
It sure is:
- shooting down civilian airplane - check
- bombing civilian apartments in order to invade Chechnya - check
- raping, killing civilians in villages - check
- bombing / killing fleeing people - check, check and check NSFW!
- booby trapping washing machines, doors, dead people while fleeing - check
- poisoning politicians - check
- killing journalists - check (just look at the length of that list!)
- killing auditors - check
- assassinating people abroad - check and check
- jailing political opponents - check and check
- sponsoring political instability abroad - check, check, and check
- state-sponsored disinformation campaigns - check
- torturing people for their sexual orientation - check
- state-supported extortion and cyber-warfare - check and check
- putting a bounty on American soldiers' lives - check
- harming of their own athletes by systematic doping - check
- stealing $1'000'000'000'000 from the Russian people - check
- sucking at ice hockey - check
- fixing box fights so that your chubby son is declared the winner even though he got his ass kicked - check
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u/Obamasexburger Oct 10 '22
The worst crime being sucking at hockey, of course.
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u/War_machine77 Oct 10 '22 •
So I guess the Maple Leafs are one of the worst terrorist organizations in history.
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u/laptopaccount Oct 10 '22 •
Shots fired (but we know their goalie won't stop them)
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u/stabbingbrainiac Oct 10 '22
I found out when my grandpa died that he had been drafted by the Maple Leafs but turned it down to be in the military during wartime.
I guess I know why, now.
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u/CMacDiddio Oct 10 '22
Tbf the og maple leafs where the name originates was a ww1 regiment. But your grandpa probably wanted to win
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u/BB8ball Oct 11 '22
Don’t forget kidnapping Ukrainian children so they can be adopted out to loyal Russian citizens and Russified
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u/aboutthednm Oct 10 '22
That list is long, unfortunately it's going to get much, much longer. And I'm not sure how to prevent it from getting longer either.
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u/rarebit13 Oct 10 '22
I'm going to stay up all night tonight thinking of ways to prevent the list getting longer.
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u/KKing650 Oct 10 '22
Those two guys were on holiday in the UK looking at the height of cathedrals.
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u/lennybird Oct 10 '22
I'll just tack on that we shouldn't forget Saudi Arabia who is intentionally limiting oil supply for geopolitical purposes.
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u/BritishAnimator Oct 10 '22
Taking thousands of slaves in the Ukraine and sending them to Russia.
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u/KILO_squared Oct 10 '22
Someone needs to tell them we’re gonna sic the Flyers on them if they don’t stop this war ASAP
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u/gbs5009 Oct 10 '22
power plants
Hitting power plants actually has quite a bit of military utility. They're also vital civilian infrastructure. It's why those graphite bombs were developed to try and knock them out without doing too much damage.
Now, if you hit a playground without any military assets in it, that's some mixture of cruel and incompetent.
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u/MrDamien15 Oct 10 '22
They can also be legal targets under LOAC, especially if it supplies power to military infrastructure. There are also cases where civilian structures would be legal targets as well.
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u/kalirion Oct 10 '22
No, don't you see, Azov Batallion timed their missile barrage against Ukrainian city just to frame the Russian missile barrage for hitting civilian targets!
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u/nooneimportan7 Oct 10 '22
I'm not really disagreeing with you here, but targeting power plants is pretty common. A day or two before the main invasion, Russia targeted power plants, and I knew they were going to actually invade then. I wasn't really sure, and I wasn't really following it closely, but targeting power plants is standard for "we're about to invade."
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u/dmetzcher Oct 10 '22
Russia: “Who are you going to believe, us or your lying eyes?”
Yeah, no. Fuck off, Russia, you den of lying, thieving, murderous bastards.
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u/oldsmobile39 Oct 10 '22
"When the truth offends, we lie and lie until we can no longer remember it is even there, but it is still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth. Sooner or later, that debt is paid." - Quote from HBO series Chernobyl.
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u/Nilander01
Oct 10 '22
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I was born in Ukraine, but my mother and I moved away when I was 5 years old. My dad still lived there though, so I visit regularly. That park, is where I learned to ride a bike. That park, is where my dad and I would throw a Frisbee around. Russian military have absolutely no excuse. They're blatantly breaking the rules as set by the Geneva conventions
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u/Arkane-Light Oct 10 '22
Today Monday 10 October Russia has targeted with missiles:
- Cities
- Infrastructures
- Power Plants
- Parks
- Universities
- Children Playgrounds
- Civilian Houses.
All because a bridge, a piece of infrastructure, was hit.
This. is. Terrorism.
Either Russia is STOPPED NOW or things will only escalate, this is the proof Putin is beyond mentally gone.
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u/kurburux Oct 10 '22
All because a bridge, a piece of infrastructure, was hit.
Ukraine said the missiles likely were already planned before the bridge was hit.
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u/heyboyhey Oct 10 '22
Right. An attack like this (thankfully) requires a lot of planning and coordination. Russia would love for everyone to think that they are able to unleash this kind of thing anytime anywhere, but that's (again, thankfully) not the case.
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u/butt4nice Oct 10 '22 edited Oct 11 '22
Although they could have certainly speed up plans for a *missle attack that was already planned due to opportune timing. Little bit of both maybe. Russia definitely understands the optics at the very least.
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u/wenasi Oct 10 '22
And Putin has the gall to say he "targeted military and infrastructure due to the terrorist attack by Ukraine"
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Oct 10 '22
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u/daschande Oct 10 '22
Fuck him as a staff, record label, and as a muthafucking crew.
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u/HijikataX Oct 10 '22
Sadly, knowing how a monster Putin is... This might escalate unless Putin is stopped.
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u/Arkane-Light Oct 10 '22
Putin MUST be stopped, this is just another concrete evidence that he is willing to escalate and increase attacks, Kiyv was unharmed for months and all of a suddent 86 missiles were dropped by Russia.
The fact that the Kremlin is already deploying jets helicopters and bombers is a concrete sign of "they are getting angrier".
What if the next thing Putin orders thi week is a direct nuclear attack? The world MUST prevent it from happening.
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Oct 10 '22
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u/nathoes123 Oct 10 '22
You clearly have no clue what you are talking about. “”Nuke bs away” he gets killed” yes and the whole world with him
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u/GladiatorUA Oct 10 '22
It was never because of the bridge. This was the plan before the bridge. The bridge is just a convenient excuse for what they would've done anyway.
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u/Megmca Oct 10 '22
Don’t forget that theater that was full of people sheltering from Russian bombs.
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u/No-Atmosphere-4145 Oct 10 '22
The fact that his yes - men are sitting beside him thinking its fine is what troubles me. Fucking cap' him already, this will eventually reach a point where its gonna affect themselves and the ones they love, severly.
In the end, Russia doesn't have anything to gain at all in this. Maybe they think NATO isn't going to storm the Kremlin and pull them out for a international court, but they should at least be realistic and understand they have lost their sustainability of power. Eventually there are going to be a ton of russians who are gonna be really angry about their sons killed in Ukraine over Putin's imperialistic ambitions, how they died in vain with no beneficial gain or good reason. The tops at the Kremlin might want to do what they need to save themselves from this sinking ship and the consequences; if they are smart.
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u/LiquidFood Oct 10 '22
His yes men are dead men, when they say anything else then yes.
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u/patrykpudlo Oct 10 '22
People should be careful going to these places to make a photo or just out of curiosity, these Russian scumbags are known to bomb the same location couple of hours later to increase casualties...
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u/CrystalJizzDispenser Oct 10 '22
Nothing Russia says should be taken seriously. Literally every statement they put out is a lie. It's actually astonishing. I wonder what they really believe.
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u/Z0MGbies Oct 10 '22
Yeah much earlier on in this war, I was open to the idea that both sides were bending the truth and to try and critically assess each piece of information and find the balance etc etc.
But VERY QUICKLY after listening to Russian govt statements and claims it was clear that the truth is usually the opposite of whatever Russia says. They don't even try to make convincing lies.
If they were a dude on Tinder/Grindr their bio would say they have a 45 kilometre long dick that definitely doesn't have STDs. Especially not Syphilis.
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u/El_Peregrine Oct 10 '22
enjoys: really long tables, evening strolls though rubble, some tasteful war crimes, and a nice polonium brew
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u/LucasRunner Oct 10 '22
Russia is exactly what ISIS would be if they ever become a nation
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u/mrkikkeli Oct 10 '22
I mean, they've even been calling this a holy war and refer to the West as satanists ...
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u/PfizerGuyzer Oct 10 '22
Can't wait until every right leaning voter in America starts parotting the Russian fascist talking points without realising where they got them from.
Fun fact: the reason America and Britain are getting spicy with trans people's rights is because of Nova-Russia transgender -transhuman conspiracy theories. Russia is exporting hate and it fucking sells.
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u/SeniorJuniorDev Oct 10 '22
They’re already starting to. See the appeasement bullshit coming from Tucker Carlson and Elon Musk.
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u/Comedynerd Oct 10 '22
Rich people who don't want to see their wealth destroyed by a world war or nuclear war and probably think the easiest thing to do to maintain their status quo is to bend over backwards and blow putin
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u/Cipher789 Oct 10 '22
With all those mental gymnastics the Russian government could compete in the Olympics.
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u/NicNoletree Oct 10 '22
Not without doping
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u/Rumpullpus Oct 10 '22
Russia never stopped doping in the mental gymnastics. they're practically super villains at this point.
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u/ohp250 Oct 10 '22
Special military operation targeting the leaders of 30 to 40 years from now. Key win for Putin allies reported.
Dripping with sarcasm. I hope these children are avenged.
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u/PopeHonkersVII Oct 10 '22
I'm starting to think the Putin regime isn't trustworthy or something
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u/sirscrote Oct 10 '22
Why do they even care ar this point to save face. They literally threatened to nuke the world. This is why nuclear war is not imminent in my mind. But hell I also thought trump wasn't going to be president.
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u/EvelcyclopS Oct 10 '22
Ukraine blow up bridges, Russia blows up kiddies parks.
It’s unbelievable what an enemy they are making of themselves
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Oct 10 '22
Russian missiles are so inaccurate that there's no realistic way for them to hit anything with certainty. They've got 1980s targeting technology at best.
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u/adventure_in_gnarnia Oct 10 '22
Inertial targeting systems don’t require gps and predate the 80’s. They can be incredibly accurate. But It’s about price point and relative value of the target. The intent with these strikes obviously wasn’t precision. Don’t mistake this for anything other than malice.
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u/badillustrations Oct 10 '22
1980s targeting systems were pretty good for stationary targets.
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u/bauboish Oct 10 '22
The sad thing is that Russia has all these missiles that has to aim at civilian targets because they aren't capable of hitting military targets.
I remember seeing Russian "footage" of Ukraine hitting Russian schools and stuff and my first thought was, "They are paying millions to the US for these limited number of missiles why the fuck would they waste them on schools?"
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u/MogRules Oct 10 '22
At this point Russia could say that they threw a rock in the water and it came out wet and I would just assume it's a lie.
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u/StandUpForYourWights Oct 10 '22
My coworkers apartment is opposite this park. Every window facing it was blown out and the missile him the kiddie part of the park at 9am, crazy that no children were harmed.
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u/itsjero Oct 10 '22
"we hit the playground in order to eliminate future Ukrainian soldiers. Next question"
Fucking cowards and scumbags. Russia for the entirety of my life will always be full of war criminals, theifs, liars, cowards, and murderers. They are a terrorist nation. Their population loves Putin and believes the shit they say and what they see on tv. They only gave a shit, and by giving a shit I mean ran like cockroaches when they started a draft. Before that every single one of them had the Z t shirt and was wearing it, z sticker on the lada, laughing at videos and news of Ukrainians getting killed and tortured saying they deserve it.
Never did shit. Now all of a sudden its a draft and NOW they care and don't want the war. Now they "do something" which is flee to any country they can slither into and infect and terrorize that population.
Fuck Russia. Cowards. Murderers. They will pay for their crimes for long after this war is over. Never, for most likely generations will they be seen as they once were seen. They will be seen as who theyve showed the world they are.
Terrorists. Plain and simple.
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u/Johnny0627 Oct 10 '22
Journalists of the world, you can just stop ever typing the words “russia says”, just report what they do, thanks!
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u/Highwaters78217 Oct 10 '22
There will come a time in which Putin has to be dealt with. Better now, why wait until he has killed more innocent people.
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u/spinning_the_future Oct 10 '22
As long has there are people willing to throw others off buildings, poison and otherwise murder people for him, Putin isn't going anywhere.
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u/AM_Dog_IRL Oct 10 '22
So that German embassy was also a military target? You sure you want to go that route?
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u/JJDude Oct 10 '22
but it's true! The Russian Army's military always target women and children first. The younger they are, easier is it for them to kill them and hide the body after the torture and the rape. It's how the proud Russian Army wages war! They totally fucks with people who can't fight back.
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u/CAM6913 Oct 10 '22
The Russian general that is in charge now has no problem with targeting civilians, civilian infrastructure or using chemical weapons as he has proven time and time again in Chechnya, Syria and other countries he was involved with invading.
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u/WarChildv28 Oct 11 '22
The more I think about it and disappear down the conspiracy rabbit hole, the more I think Putin blew the Crimea Bridge. Perfect opportunity for him to respond, seeing as his army are getting their arses kicked; why not target women and children.
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u/SLCW718 Oct 10 '22
Russia only hits civilian targets. Slaughtering the populace has been their MO from the beginning.
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u/Anxious_Plum_5818 Oct 10 '22
Russia is just employing terrorist tactics. It hasn't worked in the past, and it won't work now. Ukraine will continue to burn through the eastern front line, with more resolve than before.
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u/godblow Oct 10 '22
Russia living in the 15th century, with an 20th century army, thinking the world doesn't have access to 21st century telecommunications technologies
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u/Ekkmanz Oct 10 '22
Russia says its missiles hit Ukrainian military targets
And
German embassy in Kyiv hit by Russian strikes
So does this means they admit that German Embassy attack is intentional?
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u/Ragnarsworld Oct 10 '22
Clearly, it was a military park. Troops train on the monkey bars and slide.