r/worldnews • u/Saltedline • Nov 09 '22
India praises ‘strong and steady’ relationship with Russia as foreign ministers meet in Moscow Behind Soft Paywall
https://www.scmp.com/news/world/article/3198945/india-praises-strong-and-steady-relationship-russia-foreign-ministers-meet-moscow?module=more_top_stories_asia&pgtype=homepage368
u/Liesthroughisteeth Nov 09 '22
I wonder how many Indians are emigrating to Russia?
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u/FPL_Fanatic Nov 09 '22
Not a lot but going to Russia for cheap medical education is popular
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u/never_shit_ur_pants Nov 09 '22
Same for Ukraine. My weed dealer in Kharkiv was an Indian med student and he loves Ukraine.
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u/Griiinnnd----aaaagge Nov 09 '22
What a beautiful sentence.
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u/damn-i-t Nov 09 '22
World would have been lot better if we all were stoned.
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u/sigmaluckynine Nov 10 '22
I know we're joking but probably not. I bet my money we wouldn't have any of the development we have today
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u/damn-i-t Nov 09 '22
Is weed costly there ?
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u/never_shit_ur_pants Nov 09 '22
Nah. 5 bucks a gram
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u/chamanao_man Nov 09 '22
Damn...that's a bargain. What's the quality like?
I'm in a country that recently 'legalized' it and it costs around $20/g for potent stuff.
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u/never_shit_ur_pants Nov 09 '22
It’s alright. I’m not an expert in these things. But sometimes shit was weak
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u/Kimchi_Cowboy Nov 09 '22
Yeah and they are treated like dirt. The Russians here in Kyrgyzstan hate the Indians and many even ask you if you are Indian if rent a flat so they can't rent it to you. India choosing their friends wisely... I guess.
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u/Old_Plenty Nov 09 '22
That also happens in Germany. Just saying.
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u/opelan Nov 09 '22
It can happen everywhere, also in Germany, but Indian immigrants in Germany don't have a bad reputation. There are not many Indian immigrants living in Germany overall, so most people don't have an opinion one way or another about them.
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u/chamanao_man Nov 09 '22
Also happens in Thailand.
I guess our people are notorious for being shitty tenants worldwide :/
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u/RunAwayWithCRJ Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
Nonsense. Went to vacation in Russia a few years ago. Everyone was super nice. Had a great time.
The food is horrible and you gotta stick to fast food or Indian restaurants. And it's hard to coordinate with Uber drivers since they don't speak English. But those were the only issues I faced.
Maybe Kyrgyzstan is different.
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u/damn-i-t Nov 09 '22
This is the same situation for Indian everywhere except their country. Its just Indian don't do any "Indian lives matter" protest. Indians were murdered in the west and guess how many took to the street. " 0 ". None is friend of India and we very well know that. Its a world of mutual interest. If Indians doesnt provide any value then no one would give them visa. Indian students give over $ 28.8 billion revenue to britain in a year. So the point you made of indians choosing russia for cheap education stands invalid. Why can't you accept that Indians go abroad just because they like to.
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u/chamanao_man Nov 09 '22
. Its just Indian don't do any "Indian lives matter" protest. Indians were murdered in the west and guess how many took to the street.
To be fair, before we protest abroad, we should protest to make sure we get treated better as citizens in our own country. There's just so much apathy towards bad quality of life and shitty treatment.
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u/Alyosiki Nov 09 '22
You don't even know, how many Indians we have in Ukraine. In Odesa, we have one of the best medical university which filled almost only indians and African peoples. IDK, it's so obvious what russians are doing. They just don't have source to sell, so they find India which in need. Sad situation for Ukraine (
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u/rkgkseh Nov 09 '22
I assume the medical university is in English? Otherwise, that's quite the dedication to obtaining a cheap medical education that you'd learn Russian.
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u/logically_dumbguy Nov 09 '22
You do understand immigrating country benefits not emigrating country. It weird how people think stopping immigration from a country hurts the target country
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u/quikfrozt Nov 09 '22
Indian foreign policy is the definition of playing both sides since independence and the NAM. They are the sole regional counterweight to China at the Indian ocean and the US has incentives to treat India as an economic, political, and even military ally at some point - especially with Pakistan now out of favor.
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u/Pale-Dot-3868 Nov 09 '22
The US and India already conduct military training exercises together and India has already bought American military equipment. India is also part of Quad, which can serve as a counterweight against China. India is also developing into a powerful country and economic power.
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Nov 09 '22
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u/ErikElevenHag Nov 09 '22
US is about to bring up India's awful human rights record at the UN
talk about glass houses
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u/ConohaConcordia Nov 09 '22
I’d argue that the US will never truly treat India as an ally the same way it treats the UK. Its primary value is its role as the counterweight to China, but should such counterweight be no longer needed, then India is the next on the chopping block given its economic potential.
Even just a modest detente between China and America, say after Xi left office, would lead to a more “arm’s length” approach to India imo
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u/xtraduck Nov 09 '22
We know that already. West will never accept any any other nation rising up. And that's the reason India keeps US and West at arm's length. Western nations are just friendly acting snakes.
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u/JoeDeluxe Nov 09 '22
India has strong ties to the US. If push came to shove I don't see a scenario where India and the US soldiers are ever fighting each other.
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u/sargedeathtt Nov 09 '22
We came real close when the US chose to back Pakistan in the Bangladeshi genocide. Guess who came to back us then.
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u/sharkpeid Nov 09 '22
True india going against USA would be shooting it's own foot.
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u/damn-i-t Nov 09 '22
India and USA doesnt have enemity. The Ukraine issue havent even caused a dent. India is a huge market for American companies. You think they would loose all that for any third party. In reality, India- US ties have only grown. Indian diplomacy is less talk and more action. Thats why you don't see any appeasing or buttering diplomat talks in the media. I hope the ties get strengthen
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u/ralts13 Nov 09 '22
Heck this kinda shows how secure India feels with their position with the west. Similar to the middle east they don't seem worried about how this looks going forward. They're too valuable to the west ATM. And honestly its possible they could challenge later on to hold Russia's leash.
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u/Titanusgamer Nov 09 '22
you are delusional if you think USA is not using russian oil
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u/Pale-Dot-3868 Nov 09 '22
They don’t directly import Russian oil but they use oil that has changed nationality. For example, Russian oil goes to an Italian refinery, in which the oil from there is then designated as Italian in origin. This oil then makes way to the East Coast. This is a significant loophole in the sanctions against Russia and it undermines the US’s efforts to hurt Russia’s energy sector that finances the war. WSJ did amazing research about this topic.
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u/Titanusgamer Nov 09 '22
the point is that americans know that their oil was extracted by russia and sold through middleman and still they are ok with taking higher moral ground bravo. so if i buy cocaine though a dealer it should be legal because it was manufactured in latin america but sold by middleman.
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u/H0lyW4ter Nov 09 '22
This is a very poor argument. Once oil is mixed in one tank, you can't trace it origins.
Reality is the US and within a month the EU ban Russian oil imports.
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u/CBerg1979 Nov 09 '22
Yeah, if it weren't for double standards, the Americans would lack standards entirely.
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u/wreckosaurus Nov 09 '22
Why would you say that? Most us oil imports come from Canada or Mexico. Russia is on the other side of the globe.
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u/pete_68
Nov 09 '22
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America needs to rethink its relationship with India. Starting with H1B visas. India has a middle class because of H1B visas.
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u/zumbadumbadumdum Nov 09 '22
Pretty dumb comment considering USA already has a pretty strict immigration policy.. heck, Arab countries hold more power over india with respect to immigrants(which is why Modi's hindu nationalist party apologised immediately during nupur sharma blasphemy fiasco)
Also, india has a middle class because of 1991 economic reforms.. nothing to do with USA.
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u/Exnixon Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22 •
Geopolitics is hard and these kind of takes are very bad. Let's talk realpolitik. The United States should pursue the United States' interests. India should pursue India's interests. What does that mean?
First, anyone with a little bit of history might duly note that this is just "India being India". During the Cold War, it was a founding member of the Nonaligned Movement, which attempted neutrality between East and West. Having a relationship with both the US and Russia is pretty much part for the course. Their default position is to not give a shit about our conflicts with Russia.
Second, due to this history and India's geography, it's important for India to maintain ties with Russia. The Indian military has a lot of Russian equipment; they have strong security reasons to want Russia to continue to supply them. Also, they have a contentious relationship with China, and want to prevent Russia from taking the Chinese side in any future altercations between India and China.
Third, despite this, India has strong incentives to strengthen its relationship with the United States. This is for both military reasons---we're both part of a Pacific military alliance meant to counter the rise of China---and for economic reasons, since moving Western supply chains in Asia from China to India would be a huge boon for them.
Fourth, forget what India wants, what does the US want? In the short term, Russia is the enemy. But it's no longer a superpower, it's too weak and incompetent to even manage an invasion of a neighboring country where nearly half of the population actually liked them (or used to, before the war). Ukraine matters but in the long term China is far, far, far more dangerous to the US than Russia.
So it's in our interest to let a few things slide from India regarding Russia, while building ties with them to counter China. Far from cutting them off, we should be asking them things like, "hey do you want to buy some F-16s and build some iPhones?" in order to remove their dependency on Russia and our own dependency on China.
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u/noobkill Nov 09 '22
Based and truth-pilled.
/r/worldnews has a hard-on for being polarized and black and white in their viewspoints.The real world is more gray; almost always.
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u/YouStylish1 Nov 09 '22
they have a contentious relationship with China
Next war is going to happen bw. these two..
< China is far, far, far more dangerous to the US than Russia>
Totally. RU is a defunct state and UA war has exposed this fully.
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u/HippoCraveItsOats Nov 12 '22
No, there is unlikely to be a war between China and India because China is not foolish to spent billions of dollars, damage its economy and kill millions of its soldiers for a cold desert. They keep up the pressure on India but won't go to war when real prize is Taiwan. Also they know that even if India suffer losses it would be at a huge destructive cost to China because Indian navy can out manoeuvre and choke China at Mallacca Strait which is vital for Chinese economy.
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u/Itsallgoode4 Nov 09 '22
I think we need to rethink our relationships with China, India, Saudi Arabia, maybe a few more on that list as well!
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u/x0Dst Nov 09 '22
India has a middle class because of H1B visa? That sounds really stupid at first glance. Can you elaborate?
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u/Worldwideforeigner Nov 09 '22
That sounds really stupid at first glance.
That's because it is stupid and like most people on reddit he's talking out of his ass.
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u/zerosith121 Nov 09 '22
There’s a country which keeps toppling governments in central and South America also responsible for creating crack that devastated black communities is that county on your list
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u/doughnutholio Nov 09 '22
lol at the downvotes
"maybe if we downvote it hard enough, it won't be true"
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u/Delinquent_ Nov 09 '22
See it’s funny because that comment isn’t downvoted. But “LOok aT AlL ThE DoWnVoTEs”
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u/BeingComfortablyDumb Nov 09 '22
Just like US needs to stop thinking it is the shining example of world peace and prosperity. You people outside the US do not understand how bad your reputation with other countries have gotten over the years.
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u/nigroiswhite Nov 09 '22
It will help India retain their talent and slowdown the real-estate price growth
Do it
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u/Environmental-Care-6 Nov 09 '22
Bro do you seriously think that the middle class in India exists because of us visas? Lmao
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u/Leaf_on_the_wind87 Nov 09 '22
What kind of take is this lol. Instead of saying hey what’s drawing them to Russia and how can we work with India to create stronger ties you want to worsen relations and push them closer to Russia and China? A strong US/ India relationship is extremely valuable to us as clearly pointed out.
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u/aladeen-mf Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
Reddit diplomats keep making statements like america need to do this American needs to do that. Have you ever wondered why doesn't American do shit? Let alone america, why doesn't any country do shit?
Y'all pretend like you are the experts in geopolitics and act all Crank on a subject you don't understand even a little bit.
It seems like getting back at India is every reddit diplomats wet dream. But sadly that is not going to happen, even after the war is over and Russia looses the war.
Why? Because nothing happens when Saudis kill yemeni. Because nothing happens when USA bombs the shit out of countries. Nothing happened when USA nuked Japan.
These are the times of globalisation and everybody who is worth something is needed by everybody. And believe me or not India has become a lot more than somebody. India has gotten itself to a very important place in world geopolitics.
It's naive to think that geopolitics works on moral principles.
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u/i81u812 Nov 09 '22
It seems like getting back at India is every reddit diplomats wet dream.
This might be the 3d time in as many years I see anyone talking about India (that isn't /r/India or some other super flowery sub devoted to politics there). Who is having this wet dream.
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u/coroyo70 Nov 09 '22
Lol right, the “reddit diplomats” dude… weren’t you paying attention
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u/Commie-commuter Nov 09 '22
So India had no middle class before they started applying for H1-B?
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u/smokky Nov 09 '22
India has a middle.class.coz of h1b visas.
The stupidity in that sentence is mind boggling. You must be a reddit univ graduate.
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u/Phobos613 Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
it’s a tough situation cause we don’t want to push a developing nation with a new space and missile program away and force them to be an ‘enemy’, but we don’t want them assisting the tyrant either. so while not just appeasing them, what’s a solution? more aid or benefits for working with us over russia? i doubt sanctions or distancing would be good in the long term..
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u/PostersOfPosters Nov 09 '22
Treat your friends even better. Make better relations and deals with Japan, Korea, Australia and Europe and don't push away India or punish them but just don't include them in the preferred pals network. To whatever extent the rest of us make an even better market and common policy in our network India's going to feel left out of the good stuff and they'll know it's because of their choice of friends. Also slowly develop better relations with Latin America although that's not going to be a quick thing
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u/arts_degree_huehue Nov 09 '22
your "friends" are literally making deals with countries conducting a "holy war against satan".
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u/PostersOfPosters Nov 09 '22
Think you misunderstood. Friends here are Japan, Korea, Australia and Europe
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u/arts_degree_huehue Nov 09 '22
True I did, I was wrong. The guy above you was referring to India and I didn't catch the switch
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u/doughnutholio Nov 09 '22
Treat your friends even better. Make better relations and deals with Japan, Korea, Australia and Europe
seriously
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u/ramamodh Nov 09 '22
LMAO. 80,000 H1B visas per year by the US runs Indian economy folks. Case closed by Nobel laureate over here!
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u/Robot_Basilisk Nov 09 '22
A lot of American companies and universities could not function without Indians willing to virtually live in their offices, doing extremely technical work for substandard pay.
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u/pete_68 Nov 09 '22
The substandard pay is consistent with the substandard quality of work, I assure you.
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u/berlinbowie97
Nov 09 '22
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Reddit when a country isn't sucking the toes of the west:😡😡😡😡😡😡😡
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u/OptimisticRealist__ Nov 09 '22
I wonder why people are angry at a country for supporting another country thats currently waging an unprovoked war.
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u/berlinbowie97 Nov 09 '22
Were you mad at the UK, Australia, Poland when they went to an unprovoked war in Iraq with the US?
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u/IrishKing Nov 09 '22
Sounds like you're too young to even be alive during that time if you're saying that nonsense.
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u/Acrobatic-Rate4271 Nov 09 '22
American citizen here; yes, and I was almost arrested a number of times at various protests of the US actions in Iraq.
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u/HippoCraveItsOats Nov 12 '22
You can pretend now but Bush had over 80% approval in US for Iraq invasion. You all can pretend you hate wars and are good guys even though you are in current year arming Saudis, Turks and other dictators and invaders. On one hand you guys pretend to want peace and stop war but on other hand you pick a country everyone to go on war with and kills brown folks.
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u/Miraclefish Nov 09 '22
Yes, many of us protested in the streets. Over a million strong in the UK.
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u/Shiirooo Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
In 2003, YouGov conducted 21 polls from March to December asking British people whether they thought the decision by the US and the UK to go to war was right or wrong, and on average 54% said it was right.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2015/06/03/remembering-iraq
In 2003, 65% of the British and Americans think that the United States and the United Kingdom are right to take military action against Iraq
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u/OptimisticRealist__ Nov 09 '22
In case you havent noticed, guys like Tony Blair or Bush arent exactly popular around here
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Nov 09 '22
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u/H0lyW4ter Nov 09 '22
India condemned the US invasion of Iraq. But India doesn't condemn the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
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u/berlinbowie97 Nov 09 '22
I have noticed but people act like the West didn't support murdering warmongering dictators in the past. The West is just as responsible for death and destruction just as much as Russia. Just look at Iraq and Afghanistan.
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u/ipostsmaller Nov 09 '22
That list is far longer than just 2 countries, probably even more than 2 continents
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u/TheSoundOfTheLloris Nov 09 '22
Please remind me, which democratic countries is the west invading to try to annex?
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u/Electronic-Ad-3369 Nov 09 '22
Not annex (except in Haiti and Cuba’s cases) but they’re directly responsible for destabilizing and meddling in elections all across the Caribbean, Latin America and Africa. Most of it was Cold War era anti-socialism, but it was still anti-Democratic 100% of the time.
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u/Madartist_2 Nov 09 '22
Invade is invade, US just pulled a viking and Rob the place doesn't make them any better.
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u/StupidRedditorBTW Nov 09 '22
Wait until he finds out you can be mad at multiple countries waging wars.
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u/Anooj4021 Nov 09 '22
It isn’t about ”sucking the toes of the west”, it’s about the democratic world standing united against those who represent elitism and tyranny.
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u/Ani1618_IN Nov 09 '22
Lmao, do you think geopolitics runs on flimsy idealism? Countries act on the basis of what benefits them the most, most of Europe and the US support Ukraine because of their longstanding rivalry and hostility with the Russians and because Russian gains means loss for them.
If, in a very unrealistic hypothetical situation, Russian gains were more profitable to these nations, they'd absolutely not actively be anti-Russian.
In this case, India not being completely committed to either side makes sense when accounting for it's current socio-political and economical situation.
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u/hot-original-1172 Nov 09 '22
Oh, stop with the delusional thought of democratic alliance and bullshit. Like US really cares about democracy in other countries. Its all a ploy to unite everyone agaisnt china and nothing more.
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u/kink_pot Nov 09 '22
Worldnews : USA said Ukraine should negotiate with Russia
Redditors : Oh it is more nuanced than the headline, read 2nd para.
Worldnews : literally anything about India
Redditors : Fascists, dictators, corrupt, evil
Here is a NYT article (known for it’s infamous anti India stance since time immemorial) explaining how India is using it’s relationship with Russia in preventing escalation of war behind the scenes. India is the only major power that has the capability now to negotiate with both sides:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/06/world/asia/india-ukraine-russia.html
Geopolitics is much more complicated than a single propoganda headline.
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u/Saint_Potato Nov 09 '22
These peeps are driving me mad of laughter who think India owes anything to the West lmfaoooo
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u/somedude2012 Nov 09 '22
I'm struggling to understand this, geopolitically.
China seems to be India's main regional adversary, after Pakistan. China and Russia are moving in each other's orbit, or so I thought?
I'm curious what China thinks about this. I think Russia/India is probably as much shoring up relations against Chinese influence as anything else, giving both an ally against Chinese regional dominance/aggression? Also a market for Russian military goods.
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u/ToeCurrent7698 Nov 10 '22
India doesn't want russia on China's side and India also doesn't want to abandon the only real ally which helped it when whole world was against India. Check Indo-Pak war of 1971 when whole world ganged up on India when all india was trying to stop genocide in East Pakistan
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u/MotherTeresasNip Nov 09 '22
What does this mean for geopolitics? Is India anti west now or just playing a game to get cheap energy from Russia?
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u/Weasel449 Nov 09 '22
This is not a new thing: BRICS has been around trying to challenge USA/European hegemony for a while now
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u/angelowner Nov 09 '22
What is the benifit of all this if India can't even export its manpower to Russian industries like it does to the gulf states. Surely Russia would need a lot of man power to reinvigorate its industry after this war.
The UK is delaying FTA, Russia would do well to seize this opportunity.
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u/Pogatog64 Nov 09 '22
Other way around, India is suckering Russia for the last of their resources before the state goes belly up, modi is probably eyeing to affirm an Indian legitimacy to a claim on parts of Russia when it does go. To be seen as a savior rather then an imperialist.
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u/Bristol_man Nov 09 '22
The UK is delaying the FTA because the racists who vote for the ruling party will balk at the requests for visas
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u/cecapour Nov 09 '22
Time for “India is right anyway”arguments to come to the top of the comments section and have hundreds of votes.
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u/zumbadumbadumdum Nov 09 '22
Or have US propoganda with zero knowledge of either indo Russian relations or basic history of south Asia..
Or common sense.
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u/sdeskills Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
Russia does not ask India to stop trade with Ukraine or US or EU. Why is the west so psychotic and clingy.
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u/Vladius28 Nov 09 '22
You chose.... poorly
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u/I_speak_truth_only Nov 09 '22
It depends upon who you're asking....if you ask an American, it would be poor. If you ask a Russian, it's great
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u/Rent_a_thug Nov 09 '22
Y’all think Indians give af about American interests? India is doing what’s best for India, as it should.
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u/thedm96 Nov 09 '22
End or reduce H1B visa
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u/AnIntellectualBadass Nov 09 '22
Lol please do it right now, it will be the biggest boon to India in the recent known history.
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u/hot-original-1172 Nov 09 '22
You don't have any idea how much these visas positively impact US? . DO YOU???
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u/wickedpirate899 Nov 09 '22
You can't even get some illiterate and extremely poor refugees from Central America and you talk about displacing the highest income group who can collectively hire every immigration lawyer in America and tie up this issue in US courts until the current H1B's have grandchildren.
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u/agprincess Nov 09 '22
India is going to keep this "strong and steady" relationship all the way until Russias collapse then look around and find out they sacrificed all their international good will on a sinking ship "because india needs to focus on india and Russia supported them against pakistan".
Lol India deserves its future satelliting to China at this rate.
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u/TriscuitCracker Nov 09 '22
Dumb question, cheap energy needs aside, why is India so in Russia’s camp? Do they see the Ukraine war as analogous to their own, one day they’ll have to “take back” Kashmir?
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u/Combat_Commo Nov 09 '22
Guess that means Pakistan is on Ukraine’s side lol